Psychological aspects of traders and investors.

It is no secret that in the traders psychology plays a huge importance . Most traders trade on emotion and because of this the vast majority of traders suffer permanent losses . All felt the magic of emotional excitement in anticipation of profit when we enter the market and frightening shock when we suffering losses and pain sensitivity on the verge of coming out of the market at a loss , or what's even sadder when margin call. Sure that investors and similarly emotional experience their work and suffer disappointment.

For successful trading is necessary to control their emotions and not go at them on occasion .
Whoever does not give up but continues to struggle forced to learn.

Traders and investors who have already learned algorithms success also influenced by emotions, as well as those who who are just at the beginning. This topic is for those who already know how to make a profit but continues to suffer because of the emotions.

Offered to share experiences in dealing with psychological difficulties .

For example, as traders cope with the situation when the trade is right but for some reason begins to grow loss and need to get out of the deal but take a loss there is not any desire? There are a bunch of these questions , I propose to discuss any of them.

Good luck to us all!

Yes, the problem is stress. It makes people freeze up. Not knowing what is the right thing to do, they do nothing.

The simplest solution to stressful trading is to use a successful robot. They have no emotions, the patience of Job, and are really good with math. The benefit of starting with these helpers is that they can help you feel good about investing in the beginning while you learn, when you need the emotional boost the most. They don't make a lot of money but you get to keep what you make, that has to feel pretty good.

12 to 25% a year and being able to sleep at night is really worth a lot to me.

Bob

ForexAssistant posted:
Yes, the problem is stress. It makes people freeze up. Not knowing what is the right thing to do, they do nothing.

The simplest solution to stressful trading is to use a successful robot. They have no emotions, the patience of Job, and are really good with math. The benefit of starting with these helpers is that they can help you feel good about investing in the beginning while you learn, when you need the emotional boost the most. They don't make a lot of money but you get to keep what you make, that has to feel pretty good.

12 to 25% a year and being able to sleep at night is really worth a lot to me.

Bob

It seems that the robot solves the problem of stress, but it is not so. Trader trades with robots. Trader decides when to turn and when his robot off, switch to manual trading or not. So that the robot gives only trading algorithm to help the trader but does not completely solve the problem of stress. Trader can not stop watching the day, week or month, providing trade adviser. The operator of the robot is not only engaged in profit taking.

I agree that when we engage in deal less money it reduces stress. But at the same time decreases and profits. When profits are not able to meet our demands we increase the risk. It is running in a circle, not a solution.

'Trader can not stop watching the day, week or month, providing trade adviser. The operator of the robot is not only engaged in profit taking. '

I check my robot twice a day mostly to see how much money I have made. Also to make sure the VPS didn't crash or something else that hardly ever happens, but I just want to be sure.

My primary emotion when it comes to trading is boredom. I like designing systems and checking them out so that's not stressful and there is a certain pride that you get when one of your systems works out as you had envisioned. But again that is a positive emotion and not stress related. So, I'm afraid I don't share what ever you are assuming that happens for all traders. Trading is actually pretty easy once you know how. I make a program designed for the robot then let the robot do what it was designed to do. Pretty simple really.

Bob

'My primary emotion when it comes to trading is boredom.'

Well what can I say? You profit of 2% per month. I would not worry. Such profit is also not excite any investor. Then everyone would be bored. Investor is interested in profit of 30% and more.

I think that depends on the investor, the ones I talk to want safety first then the most they can get without compromising their safety. If investors only wanted 30% plus returns per month, who is buying annuities? Dividend stocks? Bonds?

Why the hurry? It is so much more pleasant to stroll than to always be at double time. I won't grudge you 30%, if you can make it, you worked for it, you earned it. The difference is that I am willing to take what the world offers without resistance. The forex world will give up 1 to 2% a month without resistance. I'm good with that.

Bob

So, it is proposed to reduce stress to reduce profits. Well, it really works. But I personally do not diminish the overall profit. I decrease in profit per transaction. Just open a lot of small transactions. Large number of small transactions enables us to have more profit.
When you're dealing with a small profit and small loss expected, then it is much easier to carry than a big loss.

I see your point, sort of like spreading out the load. I can see where this would lessen the emotional burden of trading but is what ever emotional stress that is left, and the time that it takes to trade, not to mention trading is one of lifetime learning jobs, is it worth the additional profits? To most here I think yes, but for some, me included, I choose the path of automation as it has usually been the path to success.

By the way, your topic just might be one of the most important topic on this forum and one great reason for coming to this forum. This is a dangerous industry, no we're not going to get run over by heavy equipment but the temptation to augment your abilities with some chemical has crushed better men than I.

An old floor trader used to do cocaine at a certain time every day to be on the top of his game just at the right time. I didn't know him back then, just listened to what he had to say, and the warning about trying to be more than you are was one of the big ones. Now, that is too big of a price to pay. And just like AA people help each other with their emotional and alcohol related problems, it would have been nice if there was something for traders to turn to other than the drugs of course. So good luck with this topic, I hope more people get into the discussion.

Bob

bad luck.
i did that a lot.
same mistake again and again.
your family, your wife, your friends they kind of pushing you to get profit more than your beginners luck.
i get profit, and they are like 'hmmm.. good 😐'
when you loose all your money, they said 'i told you 😇 😂 😡'

Im trying to get all the things right just like i did from the start, with money management, patient to wait the trend, use stop loss, news, wait for confirmation etc. but when they start to talk with me like that, my psicology like .. BOOM!!! All of my strategy become useless, i start to blame everyone even myself, overtrade, etc.. i took the vacation, but still when i got back and see the history, i start to say. 'i have to get my money back'. 'revange of the fallen'. you guess what? nothing.. gone.

Well, thats my story.. when i loose all my money, and see what happen, il tell my self, wow, i wish that time i didnt do this, didnt do that. 😁 but its too late.

I start to make deposit next month, than, its happen again.. and again, and again... any suggestion? 😭

cevsmile posted:
'
Well, thats my story:
Same mistakes again and again.
I start to make deposit next month, then, it happens again, again, and again.
'

We all have experienced this 100 times in our Forex trading life.

My suggestion would be to automate your strategy.

Yes, it is like being in the loop. Doing same mistakes over and over. There is no solution for this outside of will power and making strict and complete plan.
Determine when to trade and trade same time every day. Preferably not too many hours but the most active or the most smooth depending upon trading plan and what you are looking for.
 For example trading only 2-3 hours a day since say 8:00 a.m. to 11:00 a.m. EST or 3:00 a.m. EST to 6:00 a.m. EST. It is in case of FX market. Every market has different behavior during different times.
Determine maximum loss per trade and per day. Maximum amount of losses in a row and if one of those time and loss limits hit trading is stopped doe snot matter what is going on. It is about setting limits and capital preservation. Daily profit goal might help too. But it should be no less than daily loss limit.
It is more important than strategy... It is psychology.

CrazyTrader posted:

cevsmile posted:
'
Well, thats my story:
Same mistakes again and again.
I start to make deposit next month, then, it happens again, again, and again.
'

We all have experienced this 100 times in our Forex trading life.

My suggestion would be to automate your strategy.

CrazyTrader posted:

cevsmile posted:
'
Well, thats my story:
Same mistakes again and again.
I start to make deposit next month, then, it happens again, again, and again.
'

We all have experienced this 100 times in our Forex trading life.

My suggestion would be to automate your strategy.

thats make me feel better, EA will solve my problm, by using EA, i can set time, risk, etc like @Chikot says.
But before that, im gonna try to act like EA. I really want to beat this psychology things.
I use demo right now, its funny, my demo just stepped out 'twice' 😐. I was in demo acc before, but not this bad.
I always won when using demo before, but now?? what the..... even with demo account still im the loosers.

I watched this screencast from @kingdomvault, i should react like that.
https://screencast.com/t/n6yF1XnI

Btw, thanks for sharing guys. it really help me a lot to stay in the forex market.

'My suggestion would be to automate your strategy.'

OK, that will help your trading but the problem is not so much with your trading as it is with your mental frame of mind. Everything that happens, has a cause. Eliminate the cause and the effects change. Lalu, you mentioned that your family was influencing your decision making. This is very common and akin to what we see happening on these forums.

You give too much weight to the opinions of the untrained. There are reams of advice on these forums worth every bit as much as you get from your untrained family. Your problem is that you are listening to them instead of listening to your own head. Since you are directing your life, everyone, including me, is less capable than you. You are the very best person to make your life meaningful and rich. This is how you fail, you stop doing that for which you are the best person for the job. If you are not doing it this leaves the control to others.

Those other people are morons compared to you, why would you want to let them do your job.
Does that perspective help? I use it myself.

Here is another way to help yourself get back your self control. When I was young, I went to the Brookfield zoo where they had a monkey house that separated the humans from the monkeys by steel bars. The monkeys were agitated by the constant stream of humans but being of a lower life form had no way to voice their frustrations except by throwing things at the humans as they strolled past. They didn't have much to throw so they would throw their own feces.

As you take control over your life, others will feel like they lost something, which they did, controlling you. However, you can expect criticizing and even name calling as there is a resistance to change. Only when you do what everyone expects of you do you not get criticized, so don't let it concern you.

When this happens to me, I just visualize those monkeys throwing their excrement, then realize that they are lessor creatures. When you realize that other peoples opinions are not worth your consideration, your life will change and so will your trading because you will have the confidence to stay in control.

As to improve your work, I will leave you with the wisdom of the ages, 2 Timothy 2:15 (Bible)

   ' Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed'

Be proud of what you do and continue to learn so you can be the best that you can be, not for your family sake but for your own and because you want to present the best 'you' that you can to God or who ever it was that is responsible for us being on this planet. .

Hope this helps.

Bob

Do not gamble Forex. It is too expensive and frustrating.

I experienced it some times.
Starting at new again and hoped to master it NOW better, again.
The problem to solve seems to be taking the Forex game too personally, too much as a part of myself.
I started to use a robot, but the same problem occured although it changed to robot on or off, changing to manual or automated system.
It is impossible to switch off emotions, but it is possible to control them. More often I'm successful now.
Simply by making myself clear about, that the robot is doing well. In the next second switching off my homeoffice, going into the garden or elsewhere. This reduces the 'keeping imprisoned' in the game.
It is not, it is really not the solution to be or become nihilistic. (Close the eyes and hope for the best.) I tried it, but as a result I got nothing but a bad view on live. Regarding to Forex it didnt change the traders problem.
I prefer to carry out some statistics about relations of emotions and trade to become clearer about.
Last but not least I have very strict times in which I may look to the robot. Each week I take out two thirds of the win to a second account, which is fed with a very successful but rare signal, not more than two trades per week. So I secure a possible margin call from the robot. The second account must have min the double size of the robots account.
This system works well and produces high profits.
Nevertheless I must control the emotional problem, else my system would implode.
Once I believed to know it better than the robot, I interfered and destroyed the win of a week.
Now I'm aware of this experience and next time even if I would had been right, I know the next times the robot is right.

Basing on my experiences I suggest
1. to constate what is your valuable experience
2. differ if the oncoming decision is based on an emotion or on your experience (you may see it very easy: May you let this opprtunity go or not? If you can, you are right. To be sure, you must demonstrate this sometimes and switch off your computer. Dont rebel the next chance is coming soon...)
3. if your emotions took the better of you, get a timeout, far longer than you normally would do, spent three days without the market but not less. (There is a 72 hours border in the mind, where thoughts become obsolete.) This will strengthen your mental discipline.

I became much clearer with this conclusion.
Dont believe that it was easy for me to keep on discipline. No, it was hard and nobody was supporting me. After 6 weeks it became easier and easier.

Do not gamble Forex. It is too expensive and frustrating.

Question, why wouldn't you just use a robot that doesn't lose, that way you could always have that at least, to fall back on when your manual trading isn't going as good. You only want to quit when it seems hopeless, by using an ultra safe robot, you might not make as much money but it wouldn't be hopeless thus no instinct to quit.

Having one of those safe types, you could go out for three days, rest and come back to see if you made any money, you would already know you won't have lost any. Well, that's the way I think, anyway.

Bob

In the beginning I wrote about how I created this theme for those who already know how to trade profitably . I understand that everybody needs help , but I think that those who can not trade profitably on a demo account can not trade on a real account . To be able to trade it means to have a history of successful trading at least a year on a demo account . An exception may be for those who trade the robot and test successful trading has at least one year . Psychological help those who do not yet learned to trade , can be only one - forsake real trade ! I trade with the help of a robot and I have a history test a few years ago. For this reason alone , I trade on a real account .

So I again offer psychological problems considered here only those who already know how to trade profitably .

'So I again offer psychological problems considered here only those who already know how to trade profitably.'

=> It is sensless, contrarian trading aspect, paradoxal theory....

If you win day after day...You don't have to fight against psychological aspects. Those kind of problems only pops up into your mind when your situation is in danger... Psycho pb will change your trading plans 100 times before it finally blow up your head and also your account.

While being profitable with a long track record allows to trade without these psycho pb.

Thank you... thank you so much ...

this conversation and advice really help me to regain my confident