Signal Start
Signal Start offers reliable 24/5 email support and a refund policy, ensuring dependable service. Additionally, the white label option for signal providers comes at no extra cost, making the product both superior and cost-effective, continuously enhanced based on user feedback.
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very good in-depth analysis very useful to those who wants to follow signal providers like me.
Thank you for posting such minute details.
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I've had no real issues with signal start. Firstly my experience with autotrader.
I used autotrader a years ago and lost thousands to firstly not knowing what I am doing, real novice, and also closing the account without checking if all trades were closed - they weren't, I assumed if you are linked and resign from autotrade, all trades would be closed. I closed my laptop and never opened the platform until months later, being down a HUGE amount. I received very little sympathy... but we move on...
Signalstart has many more quality signals but you pay, of course. No issues yet, but to set your desired min/max lot size compared to the providers historic min/max lot size takes a bit of manual calculating. The "multiplier" is rubbish, it gives you more hope & useless info than real facts that you can use. Lot size and risk is everything.
You manually should check what the provider's balance is, see historically what their min/max lot size was that they used, get a ratio and apply that ratio to your own balance, knowing what your comfort min/max lot size should be taking margin level, your balance and your stress tolerance is. Then only you can apply the multiplier with confidence, in fact DO NOT put on live trade until you had a couple of trades on your DEMO account to understand how each provider trades. Only then you can play with the multiplier for each and every different provider to set to your needs.
I honestly have been profitable, by firstly being very conservative in at least a week for each provider (low lot, but never let it go "under 0.01", which if a provider uses 0.01 as his lowest lot, setting your multiplier too low, let's you deal in too many 0.01 lots, when actually the provider meant to go e.g. 0.10, then some 0.03, then many 0.01 lots. If your multiplier is too low it may be 0.03, then only 0.01 lots, which may (not may will) go against his strategy and you will lose for sure. Now that is all in ratio with your own balance. If you have say $1000, but the provider only has $100, all sorts of havoc can happen if you do not know how these ratios work. I have a healthy balance and trade not more than 0.3 to 0.5 lots per trade, which still ends up to be a good low % per trade/total trades for MY balance, everybody is different.
NOW the next is the secret of signalstart (or any autotrader, signal service):-
Carefull, when subscribing to a provider, UNTICK the box to take current open trades. The trades may be already at the dead end of a big loss and still getting bigger loss, rather take new trades when they arrive. Big losses is possible with this, I already asked them to default this box to UNTICKED, but not happened yet.
You absolutely need to view historic trades of AT LEAST a month of any signal service, longer if there are only a few trades per month. If your desired signal service can't/won't/does not have historic trades, verified by Bluefx, mql5, myfxb, FORGET IT, move on. That would be silly to read through their marketing material which are 222% lies and manipulation. Money talks, bullshit walks. Autotrade and Signal Service have enough info for you to be able make a fair decision of how providers trade.
And then the crux. Some traders do not mind big drawdown for big profits, that is an aggressive style of trading and not if you have money to lose, it is slightly like playing or gambling, but some can make short term big bucks. My money is a true investment, so I look for low drawdowns for fair returns. But it does not help you pick somebody who has 1% DD and his return is 0.5%, let's say you want to get 5% from this person, can you calculate what the drawdown would be/could be...(homework)?
So DD% vs a good (better than average) historic returns% over a period of your choice should be your goal if you wish to grow your account slowly, but safely. I pick providers with max DD of 5% - 10% and then see, how long it has been trading, how often does it trade, are there long losing streaks and does it then martingale slowly or crazy. And I honestly can say that of the 7 providers that I have, only 2 are still under "investigation", I am confident the other 5 will not go ballistic on loss (or win for that matter). Remember, very few are manual traders, most are EAs, but it is still a human who programs and sets the risks on it. Please DEMO first, can't stress that enough.
Also low DD filter only gives a handful of providers which narrows my choice. But remember is all relative once you use the multiplier for your trade account size and DD% will adjust as you change your risk.
And please do not think that others with a DD of higher than 5% are bad, there are some quality signals out there with drawdown of 15 -25%, just I personally can't handle it or afford it over time. Most accounts do not mind as they do not rely on it monthly/yearly like I do. Hope it helps, busy testing my own manual trading style and will be a provider in a couple months with 7% DD and monthly return of at least 15% based on $10 000 base.
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But you can find the providers on MFB and communicate here.
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yes thats true signalstart dont let communication between provider and subscribers.
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"Connect with each other easily?"
Wrong - the whole idea behind SignalStart is to prevent contact between signal providers and investors, so they will not be able to communicate and the business will remain purely business.
A signal provider can communicate one-sidedly with his investors by editing the description section on the signal page.
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Very good platform, and all my clients are happy so far.
I would be more happy if they would keep renovating it with new features.
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Signalstart is a good option for both intermediate and beginner traders and investors to connect with each other easily.
Because a highly professional trader with long track record will definitely choose a MAM/PAMM option in a forex broker or hedge fund and may not be offering a signal service for various reasons.
Also, an intermediate and not a highly successful trader is still much better than a beginner in forex trading and he has more experience than a completely new trader. So by copying the trades from a partially successful trader is still a better option for a beginner instead of simply gambling with real money by directly trading by himself.
Though signalstart has many limitations, but it can be very useful especially for many beginner traders and investors if they choose the signals carefully.
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I am glad to work with signalsstart since it started. I get my money on time and I am happy my signal is live and ticking on signalstart from last 9 months now with very stable returns.
I request to keep an option to talk with our followers. for better communication.
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I have to agree that so far you have maintained a overall good trading profile.
However, I am referring here about high risk traders who target high monthly % return like 100%,200% per month and not about low risk traders targeting 5% to 20% per month.
Obviously, it is very difficult to affect the trades of a low risk trader by any large entity or corporation as well, because in order to do that the market has to move hundreds of pips in one side which is usually impossible except for technical glitch or flash crash events etc.
But for a high risk trader where his margin call or max DD is 20 to 40 pips away and who is trading millions of USD using high leverage can be easily affected by a big player and a regular broker or hedge fund can easily do that for sure.
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It seems to me like you chose the wrong signals to follow, truly.
The best signals are NOT the ones which attract most subscribers, because the "herd" wants quick gains, high risk and a quick get-rich plan, and it doesn't work like this.
Want a signal which won't get wiped out fast? I advise looking up for my rules of signal searching and following them.
And if you're in doubt, pick signals of accounts which are at least 1 year old.
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true.
Unfortunately, that is the reality of the forex trading and signal service.
But actually it is not always the number of subscribers which make the algo fail, rather it is the volume of money which make the algo fail.
Also, usually the 100% winning systems busts easily, because the signal providers don't want to loose their track record of trading by closing in loss and ultimately wipe out the balance. That is exactly what the big players take the advantage and manipulate the price for a couple of times and all money gone.
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this is entirely due to what traders and system analysts call "capacity" or "divergence".
The more simultaneous funds that are being executed with one system, that system must not have high divergence. otherwise it's "capacity" will destroy any profits gained.
Darwinex explains this in their "Investable Attributes" of "capacity". See DARWIN BUX, BUC, and XUX to understand these performance metrics.
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I have already ventured on this path that you have described above -- over the past 25 months. And I have done all the things you are talking about.
I do not wholly agreed though about brokers/funds targeting a signal once it becomes popular. No intervention or manipulation on their part can have anything to do with open trades of a signal provider. these are straw man arguments. common excuses for poor performance.
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In my short history I can confirm this for a few signals already. When I join a signal it has not so many followers, then after a few weeks there are hundreds of followers. Then it busts. History repeating.
The ugly truth is you have to figure it out yourself and let nobody join your strategy :-p
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It is usually difficult to find reliable signal providers to continue with them in long term. Same is true to become a long term signal provider as well.
Because for someone to become a popular signal provider, he has to make very high % consistent daily return, otherwise, no one will even look into the signals. In order to do that obviously the signal provider has to take high risk in his account.
Next, once it becomes a little popular and number of subscribers become more, it becomes the target of big players like brokers or funds who can just manipulate the market price a couple of times so that the account will be wiped out and signal will collapse.
Many of the subscribers who have been following signals here will agree with me for most of the signals. Only those signals which makes a very low % return may continue for long time, but again the signal provider may not find much subscribers and he might be profitable even more by offering MAM.
In my perspective, the best practice is to start taking control of the signals and it's followers amounts etc once it becomes popular to fully monitor the trades and it's activity so that the trades or trading system will not be misused or manipulated by big players.
Though I was not sure whether to provide signals or offer MAM service, finally I have decided to start as a signal provider first in high risk mode and then, proceed from there. My signals might be available within next few days or weeks.
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There are several good providers, thanks!
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Very good insight on the inner workings.
I know for me, making a $5000 withdrawal daily would be amazing. Currently I fit into the other category of investors with a smaller balance. Its unfortunate that via signalstart that we're unable to connect directly with our signal provider. I'd gladly compensate my provider for good returns or lengthy service.
If there are signal providers out there with stable, sizable returns, Id be more than willing to explore any options.
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@stimblo , great tips!
I would also like to emphasize the importance of deposits and withdrawals issue:
When you see that an account made 13,000% percent already, but he has only $100 in his account, and deposited $100,000 and withdrew $999,900, that should give you a red flag.
I am over-exaggerating on purpose, but you really should not pay attention only to the percentage, as many really do.
Having said that, I want to state my set of rules, hoping it will help you or you could sympathize with it and remark on it:
1. Look carefully at the amount in the account. If it is less than what you're willing to put, don't go for it.
2. Look how many months the account has lost in the past 12 months. If it is a number you cannot cope with, don't go there (it doesn't have to be 0 losing months, but for me more than 3 losing months per year, no matter the amount, is just the statistical and psycological red line).
3. Profit factor - a major issue to look at, for signal seekers. Because of slippages and other technicalities, our account will not perform exactly as the signal account, so we want to make sure, no matter the risk we set, that at least we will have enough margin of error and still be profitable.
So my profit factor suggestion is to look for 2.0 and above, not less than that. Ever.
4. Check the monthly bar graph. Estimate how much money (or percentage) you would make each month on your own money, and deduct the monthly signal subscription from it. Verify that is a number you are satisfied with.
5. Use the advanced search criteria. My search criteria are: REAL accounts, which are around for at least 6 months, with drawdown below 50%. Then I go over the list, sorted by percentage, but I disregard immediately every account which doesn't hold my 1-4 rules.
Number of pips does not matter, price does not matter and number of trades do not matter.
Conclusion:
I was reading some of the previous posts here and was really sorry to hear that people lost money using the signals there.
Following the above set of rules and sticking with the same signal for at least a quarter of a year without canceling or moving away and trying something new, should give you ease of mind and satisfaction.
You may even subscribe to several signals at a time, as long as you keep each signal attached with a different account, and don't deviate from the rules.
Don't let large numbers, great looking graphs and on-the-spot decisions to fool you!
Best of luck!
Full Disclosure: I am a signal provider in Signal Start. My set of rules is used to locate my own, but also others who perform better than me, to invest with them and diverge my portfolio.
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Signal start seems to be a good option for both beginner traders and experienced traders to mutually benefit each other under specific scenarios, but not always.
If a signal provider will continue to provide very good signals with high percentage returns, then there is always a risk of misuse of trades to get duplicated by one of the followers to copy trades to multiple mt4 accounts.
Also, signal start has certain payment limitations which are not favourable for signal providers. For example, the signal price can be maximum 500 USD which is not good for a signal provider, because everyone will be charged the same price whether someone is having few hundred dollar balance or few thousand or million USD balance.
So most of the high % return signals usually don't last long. Either the accounts get wiped out now or later or the signal provider simply moves to better options like MAM/PAMM services.
Another payment limitation is that it has a maximum limit of 5000 USD withdrawal per day which is not suitable for signal providers with large number of subscribers.
My opinions might be biased a little because I am a signal provider, but what information I mentioned above are simple facts.
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Hi fellow investor in Signal Start.
I have been following Signal start for about 2 years now and have seen signals come and go. I have probably lost more than I have won, but now growing my account slowly.
I would like to share some tips I have learned.
1) very rarely multiply and if you do not over 3. (Seriously it may seem like a good idea to multiply; a drawdown of 6 means even if I multiply it to 10 it won’t bust and I will make so much money)
The drawdowns are constantly tested and broken. Don’t forget slippage which usually makes the investor slippage awful. To be honest now I usually multiple by .5 so reduce risk so a blown account by trader still keeps me in the game.
2) focus on saving the money vs. making money. Seriously loosing money is far too easy. Select extremely carefully. Good criteria is not just how long the signal has been around and amount person has invested themselves. Look at the date the signal became available on Signal Start and see how it has performed ever since then. Give it at least a month on Signal start before investing. Also look at the average trade time remember you cannot copy shorter trades. Also look at history, see how often the trader makes deposits and withdrawals, unless they are a PAMM of course.
