Million Dollar Pips (tarafından milliondpips)
| Kazanma : | +26241.17% |
| Düşüş | 39.44% |
| Pipler: | 5202.2 |
| Tradeler | 4497 |
| Kazandı: |
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| Kaybetti: |
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| Tür: | Demo |
| Kaldıraç: | 1:200 |
| Trading: | Otomatik |
Million Dollar Pips Tartışma
May 10, 2010 zamanından beri üye
382 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 13:28
There is no such thing like 'true ECN' available with any mt4 broker.
The few ones which are connected to some ECN feed doing it by bridges, which slows down the execution speed dramatically, hence worthless for mdp.
No matter what mt4 brokers claim themself to be, they all remain bucketshop market makers in the end.
When the client wins they lose. That's why mdp performance is going downhill. They using now all dirty tricks to defend themself. Trade execution slowing down is their best weapon on this. I'm observing this on all so called 'STP/ECN' brokers. Scambags.
The few ones which are connected to some ECN feed doing it by bridges, which slows down the execution speed dramatically, hence worthless for mdp.
No matter what mt4 brokers claim themself to be, they all remain bucketshop market makers in the end.
When the client wins they lose. That's why mdp performance is going downhill. They using now all dirty tricks to defend themself. Trade execution slowing down is their best weapon on this. I'm observing this on all so called 'STP/ECN' brokers. Scambags.
Aug 16, 2010 zamanından beri üye
453 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 13:44
True ECN will have slippage and spread,but slippage is much more related to their execution speed rather than liquidity unless you are trading 50+ lots which is doubtful on normal retail brokers. Dukas - yes. Real ECN with really big slippage sometimes :)
Bill_New_2FX posted:
fughe posted:
[quote
IF they are true ECN, then yes, they cannot take the opposite side of your trades. That is why I recommend everyone reading their client agreement in great detail. A lot of brokers are not true ECN. The match orders internally before sending positions out to the market. Those positions can be matched with whoever they decide to match with. It has been proven time and time again that brokers do act against their own clients. How to tell if you are trading on a true ECN? You should be getting worse than expected slippage for most of your orders.
I'm confused by the statement above, I thought a true ECN would not have any slippage?
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
Jan 31, 2011 zamanından beri üye
724 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 14:23
Grrrrrrr........ Alright. Since everyone wants to give complex answers and try to sound smart.......
To start, ForexPro is correct that there are NO true ECN MT4 brokers. The orders all must pass through the mt4 bridge to get to the market. The execution speed slowdown in terms of what the mt4 user does is negligible. We are talking about a slow down of a few milliseconds. If you were trading HFT systems on a big mainframe the slow down would be astronomical.
Will Schaarrand is correct that Slippage is due to insufficient liquidity, and in most cases, slippage is not an issue.
Now that we have the foundation set.....
We are referring to a very specific circumstance, which is MDP trades. MDP trades during highly volatile markets that have a strong movement in one direction. MDP is attempting to catch the reversal of this movement.
in a market maker environment, the broker takes the opposite side of virtually every trade. In an mt4 ecn environment, the broker passes the orders through the mt4 bridge to the liquidity pool to be matched with orders.
Since MDP trades during times of high volatility, that generally means that there isn't much liquidity available. For MM brokers, they don't like it because they cannot hedge the positions to keep from losing money, in ECN brokers it means...if there isn't a matching order that is in an opposing direction, they look for the next best price to fill it at.
MM brokers will generally just delay your trade until it is favorable to them. For ECN brokers, the delay happens due to attempting to match a position, failing and continuing to the next available price, etc...until it is filled.
So...in a MM environment...IF (and this never happens) they don't jack with the order and just fill it immediately, you don't get slipped. In an ECN environment, you almost always get some slippage due to the liquidity pool constantly changing, even though it is usually very small, as in 0.1 pip. The faster the market moves, the faster the liquidity is being eaten up, and the more you get slipped.
So...this is what happens when you trade MDP. Let's say the EURUSD moves up sharply enough to trigger MDP. MDP then places the stop order in anticipation of the market pulling back. What this system is counting on is....after this strong buying movement, the buyers are going to run out of steam and the sellers will take over and push the market back down. MDP would be a potential seller with the stop order in place. So.....all these sellers are trying to short...and none of them can unless there is someone willing to buy from them....but not too many or it will stablize the market. MDP is hoping to catch a buyer for it's stop order in the midst of a seller dominated market. If you get filled without slippage, you are either #1-lucky or #2- very unlucky. Lucky because you got filled with very minimal slippage in a seller dominated market and were one of the lucky ones who got filled at a good price and the market gets pushed down further and you win. Unlucky because the sellers pushed the market down enough that it triggered your stop order but not enough to overcome the overall buyer dominance and you lose again cause the market reverses against you.
i hope this gives you a thorough understanding of why MDP is having so much trouble.
To start, ForexPro is correct that there are NO true ECN MT4 brokers. The orders all must pass through the mt4 bridge to get to the market. The execution speed slowdown in terms of what the mt4 user does is negligible. We are talking about a slow down of a few milliseconds. If you were trading HFT systems on a big mainframe the slow down would be astronomical.
Will Schaarrand is correct that Slippage is due to insufficient liquidity, and in most cases, slippage is not an issue.
Now that we have the foundation set.....
We are referring to a very specific circumstance, which is MDP trades. MDP trades during highly volatile markets that have a strong movement in one direction. MDP is attempting to catch the reversal of this movement.
in a market maker environment, the broker takes the opposite side of virtually every trade. In an mt4 ecn environment, the broker passes the orders through the mt4 bridge to the liquidity pool to be matched with orders.
Since MDP trades during times of high volatility, that generally means that there isn't much liquidity available. For MM brokers, they don't like it because they cannot hedge the positions to keep from losing money, in ECN brokers it means...if there isn't a matching order that is in an opposing direction, they look for the next best price to fill it at.
MM brokers will generally just delay your trade until it is favorable to them. For ECN brokers, the delay happens due to attempting to match a position, failing and continuing to the next available price, etc...until it is filled.
So...in a MM environment...IF (and this never happens) they don't jack with the order and just fill it immediately, you don't get slipped. In an ECN environment, you almost always get some slippage due to the liquidity pool constantly changing, even though it is usually very small, as in 0.1 pip. The faster the market moves, the faster the liquidity is being eaten up, and the more you get slipped.
So...this is what happens when you trade MDP. Let's say the EURUSD moves up sharply enough to trigger MDP. MDP then places the stop order in anticipation of the market pulling back. What this system is counting on is....after this strong buying movement, the buyers are going to run out of steam and the sellers will take over and push the market back down. MDP would be a potential seller with the stop order in place. So.....all these sellers are trying to short...and none of them can unless there is someone willing to buy from them....but not too many or it will stablize the market. MDP is hoping to catch a buyer for it's stop order in the midst of a seller dominated market. If you get filled without slippage, you are either #1-lucky or #2- very unlucky. Lucky because you got filled with very minimal slippage in a seller dominated market and were one of the lucky ones who got filled at a good price and the market gets pushed down further and you win. Unlucky because the sellers pushed the market down enough that it triggered your stop order but not enough to overcome the overall buyer dominance and you lose again cause the market reverses against you.
i hope this gives you a thorough understanding of why MDP is having so much trouble.
Make losses, but always come out a winner at the end.
Aug 16, 2010 zamanından beri üye
453 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 14:28
Anthony, very good a detailed explanation. I concur with what you are saying.
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
Jul 06, 2011 zamanından beri üye
80 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 15:09
Dat's what I like a good zhimple explanation!
Feb 09, 2011 zamanından beri üye
320 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 15:13
But is this what You want to believe?
I advise You not to bite every crap ppl are writing here.
Low liquidity during the spikes? What a bullshit :)
But I will keep it to a reader of this forum to do some work and find out for himself
how everything works. One thing is sure, MDP strategy is brilliant.
btw.
Anyone knows who prince michael is ? Can't find such user here
Prince michael from
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjzNuD3Nx5judHBWdGR2YkwyVU1XQ1JjOFdObmFISnc&;amp#gid=0
I advise You not to bite every crap ppl are writing here.
Low liquidity during the spikes? What a bullshit :)
But I will keep it to a reader of this forum to do some work and find out for himself
how everything works. One thing is sure, MDP strategy is brilliant.
btw.
Anyone knows who prince michael is ? Can't find such user here
Prince michael from
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjzNuD3Nx5judHBWdGR2YkwyVU1XQ1JjOFdObmFISnc&;amp#gid=0
Better to lose an oportunity than a money
Jul 06, 2011 zamanından beri üye
80 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 15:23
Yep, I talked with him the other day:
Prince Michael (the Archangel)
827 South Pearly Gate
Heaven 3478😎
Prince Michael (the Archangel)
827 South Pearly Gate
Heaven 3478😎
Jan 31, 2011 zamanından beri üye
724 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 15:58
crashev posted:
But is this what You want to believe?
I advise You not to bite every crap ppl are writing here.
Low liquidity during the spikes? What a bullshit :)
But I will keep it to a reader of this forum to do some work and find out for himself
how everything works. One thing is sure, MDP strategy is brilliant.
btw.
Anyone knows who prince michael is ? Can't find such user here
Prince michael from
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjzNuD3Nx5judHBWdGR2YkwyVU1XQ1JjOFdObmFISnc&;amp#gid=0
You gotta read and understand the entire post. Low liquidity in one direction. When the market is moving far and fast in one direction, there is low liquidity in the opposing direction. Market dynamics 101.
Make losses, but always come out a winner at the end.
Jan 31, 2011 zamanından beri üye
724 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 16:00
stoneflash posted:
Yep, I talked with him the other day:
Prince Michael (the Archangel)
827 South Pearly Gate
Heaven 3478😎
:D Good one!!
Make losses, but always come out a winner at the end.
Dec 15, 2010 zamanından beri üye
795 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 16:32
Small trades again this morning. Everyone is in the profits this week with my server group. Congrat's to all involved.
Aloha Garry
Aloha Garry
Click on my Name to see My Live Charts and Bio.
Dec 15, 2010 zamanından beri üye
795 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 16:33
Thats funny, looks like a real address....
stoneflash posted:
Yep, I talked with him the other day:
Prince Michael (the Archangel)
827 South Pearly Gate
Heaven 3478😎
Click on my Name to see My Live Charts and Bio.
Dec 15, 2010 zamanından beri üye
795 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 16:42
Your welcome to join my group on my private server. Start with a small account and let me help you. You have already bought the softare, Lets let it work in a better environment. Dont give up.
Sincerely Garry
Sincerely Garry
mcymcy posted:
Too many things too many comments...
First I tried with Iam Fx-------MDP loss....
Then tried with Alpari Ru-----MDP loss again....
... tried with Trader's Way---MDP loss classically....
...tried with ATC Brokers-----MDP loss as usual...
...tried with 'recommended' pepperstone----again loss...
MDP is an useless bot. It can be only work at demos... Because of this the developer can only show us a demo...
And with this EA only the developer gain too much money...:)
Click on my Name to see My Live Charts and Bio.
Jul 06, 2011 zamanından beri üye
80 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 17:24
Thanks Prof & Fughe.. the room needed a lil levity.. lol.. Had 13 t'day .. 5 wins.. -23 pips.. ouch!
MDP home US/JY hasn't had a trade since Sept 21
MDP home US/JY hasn't had a trade since Sept 21
forex_trader_27164
Jan 16, 2011 zamanından beri üye
69 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 17:24
Professor53 posted:
Small trades again this morning. Everyone is in the profits this week with my server group. Congrat's to all involved.
Aloha Garry
Professor53, what do you mean 'my server group' ? Kindly enlighten me ? 😄
Jan 31, 2011 zamanından beri üye
724 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 17:45
hagenuk posted:
Professor53 posted:
Small trades again this morning. Everyone is in the profits this week with my server group. Congrat's to all involved.
Aloha Garry
Professor53, what do you mean 'my server group' ? Kindly enlighten me ? 😄
go to https://www.professor53.com
Professor runs a private professional VPS service.
Make losses, but always come out a winner at the end.
Aug 16, 2010 zamanından beri üye
453 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 19:39
Apparently man never traded news or order flow ROFL
fughe posted:
crashev posted:
But is this what You want to believe?
I advise You not to bite every crap ppl are writing here.
Low liquidity during the spikes? What a bullshit :)
But I will keep it to a reader of this forum to do some work and find out for himself
how everything works. One thing is sure, MDP strategy is brilliant.
btw.
Anyone knows who prince michael is ? Can't find such user here
Prince michael from
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjzNuD3Nx5judHBWdGR2YkwyVU1XQ1JjOFdObmFISnc&;amp#gid=0
You gotta read and understand the entire post. Low liquidity in one direction. When the market is moving far and fast in one direction, there is low liquidity in the opposing direction. Market dynamics 101.
Was mich nicht umbringt, macht mich stärker.
Sep 22, 2011 zamanından beri üye
10 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 19:52
I don't get your rationale...
If in a seller dominated market, i.e. everyone's selling, MDP wants to buy, there wouldn't be any shortage of sellers to sell to MDP buyers. wouldn't it?
If in a seller dominated market, i.e. everyone's selling, MDP wants to buy, there wouldn't be any shortage of sellers to sell to MDP buyers. wouldn't it?
fughe posted:
Grrrrrrr........ Alright. Since everyone wants to give complex answers and try to sound smart.......
To start, ForexPro is correct that there are NO true ECN MT4 brokers. The orders all must pass through the mt4 bridge to get to the market. The execution speed slowdown in terms of what the mt4 user does is negligible. We are talking about a slow down of a few milliseconds. If you were trading HFT systems on a big mainframe the slow down would be astronomical.
Will Schaarrand is correct that Slippage is due to insufficient liquidity, and in most cases, slippage is not an issue.
Now that we have the foundation set.....
We are referring to a very specific circumstance, which is MDP trades. MDP trades during highly volatile markets that have a strong movement in one direction. MDP is attempting to catch the reversal of this movement.
in a market maker environment, the broker takes the opposite side of virtually every trade. In an mt4 ecn environment, the broker passes the orders through the mt4 bridge to the liquidity pool to be matched with orders.
Since MDP trades during times of high volatility, that generally means that there isn't much liquidity available. For MM brokers, they don't like it because they cannot hedge the positions to keep from losing money, in ECN brokers it means...if there isn't a matching order that is in an opposing direction, they look for the next best price to fill it at.
MM brokers will generally just delay your trade until it is favorable to them. For ECN brokers, the delay happens due to attempting to match a position, failing and continuing to the next available price, etc...until it is filled.
So...in a MM environment...IF (and this never happens) they don't jack with the order and just fill it immediately, you don't get slipped. In an ECN environment, you almost always get some slippage due to the liquidity pool constantly changing, even though it is usually very small, as in 0.1 pip. The faster the market moves, the faster the liquidity is being eaten up, and the more you get slipped.
So...this is what happens when you trade MDP. Let's say the EURUSD moves up sharply enough to trigger MDP. MDP then places the stop order in anticipation of the market pulling back. What this system is counting on is....after this strong buying movement, the buyers are going to run out of steam and the sellers will take over and push the market back down. MDP would be a potential seller with the stop order in place. So.....all these sellers are trying to short...and none of them can unless there is someone willing to buy from them....but not too many or it will stablize the market. MDP is hoping to catch a buyer for it's stop order in the midst of a seller dominated market. If you get filled without slippage, you are either #1-lucky or #2- very unlucky. Lucky because you got filled with very minimal slippage in a seller dominated market and were one of the lucky ones who got filled at a good price and the market gets pushed down further and you win. Unlucky because the sellers pushed the market down enough that it triggered your stop order but not enough to overcome the overall buyer dominance and you lose again cause the market reverses against you.
i hope this gives you a thorough understanding of why MDP is having so much trouble.
Mar 07, 2010 zamanından beri üye
35 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 19:59
tharaka posted:
I don't get your rationale...
If in a seller dominated market, i.e. everyone's selling, MDP wants to buy, there wouldn't be any shortage of sellers to sell to MDP buyers. wouldn't it?
But when MDP exits the trades, it will have to sell and sometimes there will be shortage of buyers. Especially if there are a lot of MDP users at one broker and they're all trying to close their trades by selling, who are they going to sell to?
Jan 31, 2011 zamanından beri üye
724 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 20:52
(Oct 06, 2011 at 20:53 düzenlendi)
tharaka posted:
I don't get your rationale...
If in a seller dominated market, i.e. everyone's selling, MDP wants to buy, there wouldn't be any shortage of sellers to sell to MDP buyers. wouldn't it?
Okay, I see you confusion. Read this over, Tharaka, and let me know if this makes more sense. We assume market just had a big upward spike that wold trigger MDP to place sell stops. This upward spike would have been because there was way more buyers than sellers, or the buyers were buying more than the sellers. So...near the end of the spike, MDP has a sell stop order in hopes that the buyers will run out of momentum and the sellers will out weight the buyers. So we suddenly have a bunch of people selling and there are more people selling than there are buying to the point that there aren't enough buyers at that level to keep the price form dropping. NOW...the reason why the price has started to drop is because for every sell, there must be a matching buy...and if there is no matching buy...then the price must fall the the next available price someone is willing to buy at. So in essence, there is a shortage of buyers, which is what causes the market to reverse. When the market gets low enough to trigger your stop order there are 3 scenarios that will play out. #1-you stop is sent to market to be filled and the buyers regain control of the market. In this case, you may get your price, but since the buyers now out weigh the sellers, the price will move against your open position. #2- buyers and sellers equal each other. In this case, the market stops and just hovers right around the area within a pip or so of you open order, which will get filled with, most likely, no slippage. #3- the sellers far out weigh the buyers and as you stop order is sent to market, all available buy orders have already been filled at you requested price level...so your broker goes to the next available buyer to try and get your position filled, and so on until the position gets filled. You will always get slipped in this scenario. How much will depend on how fast the market is moving. Some times a few pips (most common) and sometimes 10 or 20 or more pips (which I have seen during highly volatile news releases).
Basically, for every buyer, there must be someone willing to sell at that price. For every seller, there must be a buyer willing to buy at that price. When there is no match, that is when slippage comes in. Essentially, the system is filling you order by matching it with the closest available position.
Make losses, but always come out a winner at the end.
Sep 14, 2011 zamanından beri üye
140 iletiler
Oct 06, 2011 at 22:04
But this rationale drives to conclusion that slippage works in favour for MDP helping to fulfill the order :))))) no sence ?
fughe posted:
tharaka posted:
I don't get your rationale...
If in a seller dominated market, i.e. everyone's selling, MDP wants to buy, there wouldn't be any shortage of sellers to sell to MDP buyers. wouldn't it?
Okay, I see you confusion. Read this over, Tharaka, and let me know if this makes more sense. We assume market just had a big upward spike that wold trigger MDP to place sell stops. This upward spike would have been because there was way more buyers than sellers, or the buyers were buying more than the sellers. So...near the end of the spike, MDP has a sell stop order in hopes that the buyers will run out of momentum and the sellers will out weight the buyers. So we suddenly have a bunch of people selling and there are more people selling than there are buying to the point that there aren't enough buyers at that level to keep the price form dropping. NOW...the reason why the price has started to drop is because for every sell, there must be a matching buy...and if there is no matching buy...then the price must fall the the next available price someone is willing to buy at. So in essence, there is a shortage of buyers, which is what causes the market to reverse. When the market gets low enough to trigger your stop order there are 3 scenarios that will play out. #1-you stop is sent to market to be filled and the buyers regain control of the market. In this case, you may get your price, but since the buyers now out weigh the sellers, the price will move against your open position. #2- buyers and sellers equal each other. In this case, the market stops and just hovers right around the area within a pip or so of you open order, which will get filled with, most likely, no slippage. #3- the sellers far out weigh the buyers and as you stop order is sent to market, all available buy orders have already been filled at you requested price level...so your broker goes to the next available buyer to try and get your position filled, and so on until the position gets filled. You will always get slipped in this scenario. How much will depend on how fast the market is moving. Some times a few pips (most common) and sometimes 10 or 20 or more pips (which I have seen during highly volatile news releases).
Basically, for every buyer, there must be someone willing to sell at that price. For every seller, there must be a buyer willing to buy at that price. When there is no match, that is when slippage comes in. Essentially, the system is filling you order by matching it with the closest available position.
