DEMO ACCOUNT vs LIVE ACCOUNT
Mar 11, 2015 at 23:50
kricka posted:
kanon103, I agree what you say, EA and you're kind of out of the manual emotional trading scenario, to some extent, for awhile. The question is, what happens if the EA is going haywire, to make an example a draw down of 30% in a couple of days, and you start thinking, whats wrong? Or do I have to make some changes to the EA to cut the losses? Do this scenario affect us emotionally, yes it does, so EA in the long run is not emotionless.
true about 'EA in the long run is not emotionless', but that does not change the answer what i have answered to the topic of 'A well designed EA run profitably on a Demo account then it's 99.99 percent certain these resulted can be replicated in a Live account'
if the demo has DD of 30% like you said. so will the live account. nothing about emotional at this point.
Mar 12, 2015 at 00:07
On a demo account I would agree on this. On a live account it is a concern. If the trading plan is that it can stand a 30% draw down and we are sticking to our trading strategy, no matter what, it can very well be so that it will turn out in our favor at the end.
A 30% draw down of a strategy do affect us in one way or the other more in a live account, then in a demo account.
A 30% draw down of a strategy do affect us in one way or the other more in a live account, then in a demo account.
" Lock in the profit and minimize the draw down "
Mar 17, 2015 at 18:51
essenn posted:
From my personal experience, A demo account is an accurate representation of a live account, If a Pro trader or A well designed EA run profitably on a Demo account then it's 99.99 percent certain these resulted can be replicated in a Live account.
Discuss.. 😁
i did wipe out my 2 live accounts 😀 it's all mind game you take more stress on live other then demo that's the main problem i think 😝
“The past can't hurt you anymore, not unless you let it.”
Mar 25, 2015 at 10:14
Hello, I found good system, check this out.
<a href='https://www.myfxbook.com/members/mt5fxea_/insta-forex/1186021'><img border='0' src='https://widgets.myfxbook.com/widgets/1186021/large.jpg'/></a>
<a href='https://www.myfxbook.com/members/mt5fxea_/insta-forex/1186021'><img border='0' src='https://widgets.myfxbook.com/widgets/1186021/large.jpg'/></a>
Mar 25, 2015 at 10:27
Columbus posted:
Hello, I found good system, check this out.
<a href='https://www.myfxbook.com/members/mt5fxea_/insta-forex/1186021'><img border='0' src='https://widgets.myfxbook.com/widgets/1186021/large.jpg'/></a>
in case you did not see....
Track Record Not Verified
Trading Privileges Not Verified
i bet this is fake real account. most likely.
Mar 25, 2015 at 10:39
(redigerad Mar 25, 2015 at 10:40)
Columbus posted:
Hello, I found good system, check this out.
<a href='https://www.myfxbook.com/members/mt5fxea_/insta-forex/1186021'><img border='0' src='https://widgets.myfxbook.com/widgets/1186021/large.jpg'/></a>
i just checked their website
the EA is Arbitrage that will ONLY works on demo.
100% scam
Medlem sedan Sep 06, 2013
137 inlägg
Mar 25, 2015 at 15:12
Yep total scam!
Well for Newbies here's what a GENUINE account should look like: https://www.myfxbook.com/members/BenNathanFTA/wwwfxnewstradercouk-daily-trade-alerts-live/1172397
So you should have 2 green ticks at the top! Anything non verified - or demo - avoid in my opinion....
Also dont get fooled by thinking you can just jump on to someone elses system and be done with it - take the time to learn, and take the time to find those willing to teach.....
And in terms of Real Vs Demo - Real is a very different bag altogether... in theory it shouldn't be but in reality is is... HOWEVER, some brokers such as instafx offer a no deposit bonus for opening an account - this is good as you can experience a live market with no risk..... just dont expect to be able to withdraw the funds as generally it doesn't happen as you have to have bet something like 10000 times the amount of the deposit - BUT its a way to play in the live markets.
Well for Newbies here's what a GENUINE account should look like: https://www.myfxbook.com/members/BenNathanFTA/wwwfxnewstradercouk-daily-trade-alerts-live/1172397
So you should have 2 green ticks at the top! Anything non verified - or demo - avoid in my opinion....
Also dont get fooled by thinking you can just jump on to someone elses system and be done with it - take the time to learn, and take the time to find those willing to teach.....
And in terms of Real Vs Demo - Real is a very different bag altogether... in theory it shouldn't be but in reality is is... HOWEVER, some brokers such as instafx offer a no deposit bonus for opening an account - this is good as you can experience a live market with no risk..... just dont expect to be able to withdraw the funds as generally it doesn't happen as you have to have bet something like 10000 times the amount of the deposit - BUT its a way to play in the live markets.
HOLY GRAIL: Fundamental Analysis to chose your pairs/direction, Technical Entry/SL/TP for consistent Management of those decisions
Medlem sedan Jun 14, 2013
130 inlägg
Mar 25, 2015 at 21:46
I agree with the comments of James Smith and Ben Nathan...
I personally stay away from EA's. In the long run markets are dynamic. EA's tend to fall off over time and may cost you your account. Also, people running EA's have to compete with multi-million dollar High Frequency Trading systems operating directly from the broker network systems, which makes thousands of transactions per second... And EA running off a PC cannot compete with the speed of these systems.
As far as Demo Accounts vs. Live Accounts are concerned I wish to add my own comments as follows:
a) A Demo Account does not invoke the human emotional responses a Live Account does. This is the reason an estimated 90% of all new traders will blow up their accounts. Learning to cope with these emotions is the biggest challenge any new trader faces. In my opinion the best way to use a demo account is to formulate your own trading plan, which should include a well designed trading strategy, strict set of personal trading rules (aimed at controlling your emotions) and a solid risk/reward profile which should be developed to minimize risk (losses) and maximize profits. Once you have all of these figured out you should practise your trading discipline with a demo account and improve/adjust your trading strategy until you feel comfortable with it.... this may take some time, but treat your demo account as if it is a live account.
b) A Demo Account does not have the transaction delay's or 're-quotes' usually associated with live accounts. In some cases this may result in failed opening or closing of positions during periods of high volatility and volume. This is why it is important to have a good risk/reward profile with strict rules that you must adhere to.
These, in my opinion, are the only real differences between the two worth noting.
Hope this helps.
Cheers!
I personally stay away from EA's. In the long run markets are dynamic. EA's tend to fall off over time and may cost you your account. Also, people running EA's have to compete with multi-million dollar High Frequency Trading systems operating directly from the broker network systems, which makes thousands of transactions per second... And EA running off a PC cannot compete with the speed of these systems.
As far as Demo Accounts vs. Live Accounts are concerned I wish to add my own comments as follows:
a) A Demo Account does not invoke the human emotional responses a Live Account does. This is the reason an estimated 90% of all new traders will blow up their accounts. Learning to cope with these emotions is the biggest challenge any new trader faces. In my opinion the best way to use a demo account is to formulate your own trading plan, which should include a well designed trading strategy, strict set of personal trading rules (aimed at controlling your emotions) and a solid risk/reward profile which should be developed to minimize risk (losses) and maximize profits. Once you have all of these figured out you should practise your trading discipline with a demo account and improve/adjust your trading strategy until you feel comfortable with it.... this may take some time, but treat your demo account as if it is a live account.
b) A Demo Account does not have the transaction delay's or 're-quotes' usually associated with live accounts. In some cases this may result in failed opening or closing of positions during periods of high volatility and volume. This is why it is important to have a good risk/reward profile with strict rules that you must adhere to.
These, in my opinion, are the only real differences between the two worth noting.
Hope this helps.
Cheers!
Keep it simple, be disciplined, get rich slowly and above all protect your equity!
Mar 25, 2015 at 23:18
Jaco, you are so right in what you are saying. EA's without a very strict risk & money management account protection are doomed to fail at one time or the other. I do however think an EA can be profitable as long as you have the rmm protection running in the background if the EA goes out of control. Rmm robots or EA's are needed for the trader to be able to relax. A lot of emotional issues will be eliminated by having a security net for sure.
" Lock in the profit and minimize the draw down "
Medlem sedan Jun 14, 2013
130 inlägg
Mar 26, 2015 at 08:29
kricka posted:
Jaco, you are so right in what you are saying. EA's without a very strict risk & money management account protection are doomed to fail at one time or the other. I do however think an EA can be profitable as long as you have the rmm protection running in the background if the EA goes out of control. Rmm robots or EA's are needed for the trader to be able to relax. A lot of emotional issues will be eliminated by having a security net for sure.
Hi Kricka...
I have very limited experience with EA's. In a way I guess I am really not qualified to comment on the success of EA's. EA's, like manual trading I suppose, can work if you have a very disciplined approach, and like you so wisely said, can work if you implement strict risk & money management rules.
I tested an EA written by Jim Dandy (not sure if you are familiar with his work - very clever man and accomplished programmer) over a period of about four months, admittedly I did not use a VPS, so the EA only ran while my PC was on. In South Africa, we unfortunately have to live with low speed internet connections, and added to that we have regular intermittent power cuts. I guess because of this I gave up. However, I was surprised with the results in the first 6 to 8 weeks. Besides all the obvious limitations of my infrastructure, the one thing that bothered me most was the 43% drawdown against a 248% gain. Now I know this does not seem to be too bad a trade-off, but I found myself stressing out more than I would with manual trading. I started trading during the flash crash of the NASDAQ in 2010, and the thought of my EA wiping out my account without my knowledge in a similar event, just scared the crap out of me... 😄
Anyway, like I said before, I am not really qualified to offer a valid opinion on EA's since I have very limited experience with them. I personally think if you wish to pursue EA's you have to first have an in-depth understanding of trading and how markets react and change over time, so you will be able to adjust and tweak your EA accordingly. In light of this, I would think that new traders should not dive into EA's early in their trading careers. I have been trading for about 5 years now. Perhaps when I have much more experience and a better understanding of the workings of the markets, I may attempt EA's again.
Regards
Cheers! 😎
Keep it simple, be disciplined, get rich slowly and above all protect your equity!
Medlem sedan Sep 06, 2013
137 inlägg
Mar 27, 2015 at 10:06
The simple reason behind why no EA can ever make a profit forever is simple.... NO EA can do the one thing critical for sustained income... and that's be aware of market conditions and the actual DRIVING FORCE behind the moves, therefore they will work for a period of time when the market is acting in a certain way but ultimately when the fundamentals and the markets change, the EA has no knowlege of this and carries on trading regardless and then ends up failing...
HOLY GRAIL: Fundamental Analysis to chose your pairs/direction, Technical Entry/SL/TP for consistent Management of those decisions
Mar 27, 2015 at 21:10
(redigerad Mar 27, 2015 at 21:27)
Ben I agree, that is why we can not let individuals EA's to be in totally control of our trading accounts. I am of the belief that a separate EA or robot or cBot, which ever the platform one is trading on, has to have a separate 'RMM Robot', risk & money management algorithm running that is dedicated solely for the purpose of protection our invested funds. Markets will change as it always has, we have to protect our self the best we can for these unpredictable moves that the market does.
" Lock in the profit and minimize the draw down "
Oct 15, 2015 at 09:57
essenn posted:
From my personal experience, A demo account is an accurate representation of a live account, If a Pro trader or A well designed EA run profitably on a Demo account then it's 99.99 percent certain these resulted can be replicated in a Live account.
Discuss.. 😁
You will struggle more emotional control when you're about to trade in live account. You might went crazy when you were lose $10 in real account than lose $10.000 in a demo account. And one thing, most of the newbies were quit when they lose around $20-$30 in a real account due to overconfident.
Medlem sedan May 18, 2015
118 inlägg
Oct 15, 2015 at 11:56
BenNathanFX posted:
The simple reason behind why no EA can ever make a profit forever is simple.... NO EA can do the one thing critical for sustained income... and that's be aware of market conditions and the actual DRIVING FORCE behind the moves, therefore they will work for a period of time when the market is acting in a certain way but ultimately when the fundamentals and the markets change, the EA has no knowlege of this and carries on trading regardless and then ends up failing...
Not unless the EA is price action based. Price action ALWAYS remains the same, no matter what market condition it is. That is a known fact and can be seen in the charts.
My avatar explains "social trading" perfectly.
forex_trader_29148
Medlem sedan Feb 11, 2011
1916 inlägg
Oct 16, 2015 at 17:37
goyankees85 posted:BenNathanFX posted:
The simple reason behind why no EA can ever make a profit forever is simple.... NO EA can do the one thing critical for sustained income... and that's be aware of market conditions and the actual DRIVING FORCE behind the moves, therefore they will work for a period of time when the market is acting in a certain way but ultimately when the fundamentals and the markets change, the EA has no knowlege of this and carries on trading regardless and then ends up failing...
Not unless the EA is price action based. Price action ALWAYS remains the same, no matter what market condition it is. That is a known fact and can be seen in the charts.
alrighty😄
Medlem sedan Sep 12, 2015
1948 inlägg
Oct 16, 2015 at 17:41
essenn posted:
From my personal experience, A demo account is an accurate representation of a live account, If a Pro trader or A well designed EA run profitably on a Demo account then it's 99.99 percent certain these resulted can be replicated in a Live account.
Discuss.. 😁
That depends on the broker and how they have setup each,I have noticed some demos are faster than the live account,this makes sense too,since the orders are dealt with in house ,I scalp the eur/usd it's noticeable.Its good to back test but don't expect the same results forward testing.
"They mistook leverage with genius".
Oct 17, 2015 at 00:26
kieran, I have been test trading a lot of demo accounts when building strategies and cBots. My experience is that demo accounts do not differ that much compared to live accounts. I worked mostly on the cTrader platform and mt4 might differ somewhat in this regard when it comes to the accuracy between a live and a demo account. Anyways RMM ( risk and money management ) should be a priority whatever platform one is using. RMM Robot is easily searched on Google to get more info on this so important subject.
" Lock in the profit and minimize the draw down "
Medlem sedan Sep 12, 2015
1948 inlägg
Oct 17, 2015 at 15:44
ReiGn posted:
Hi im new to trading and i would like to ask if pellucidfx is a trustworthy broker
A trust worthy broker.....mmmmmm
Well it depends what you call trustworthy!
"They mistook leverage with genius".
Medlem sedan Aug 27, 2015
8 inlägg
Oct 23, 2015 at 16:35
essenn posted:I'm just starting on real account. After the Demo it is very huge difference.
From my personal experience, A demo account is an accurate representation of a live account, If a Pro trader or A well designed EA run profitably on a Demo account then it's 99.99 percent certain these resulted can be replicated in a Live account.
Discuss.. 😁
I think have to learn more to be a professional but it needs years... ((
